Radio Wars, Part 2

[gyro]

went to my not so local hobby shop yesterday. they didnt have the 8fg and just sold their last dx8 right before i got there. does the dx8 have the same case as the dx7? cause they did have a dx7

I believe the cases are very close. I had a dx7 and upgraded to a dx8, and the transition was simple.

 

[Manta]

You were VERY lucky that you were running separate power and radio batteries. It could have been real nasty if you plane had powered up in the pit area, potentially causing a lot of damage to other models and worse still people. It couldn't have happened with Model-Match

Yea i was lucky, but it was my fault. Model match to me isn't as important as a good solid, trustworthy link. And spectrum aint got it. Their newest "hopping" system may be better, but Ive still watched planes go down for no apparent reason at crowded events. Ill stick with my non model match for now.
No doubt I was lucky tho. And everyone in the pitts was lucky too

 

[Steve_B]

For the record, Horizon Hobby neither endorses, nor recommends the use of these copied receives as they haven't been tested by Horizon, and there is no way to verify the quality control.
I'd much rather hit the classifieds and pick up a used Spektrum receiver for 50-60% of the new price.

Of course that's true, Horizon are never going to test and endorse 'compatible' receivers, it would be cutting their own throats to do so. FWIW I've used a couple of Orange receivers and they seem to be perfectly reliable but I admit for the models I care about I do use genuine Spektrum, which are not too badly priced.

 

[Steve_B]

... a good solid, trustworthy link. And spectrum aint got it. Their newest "hopping" system may be better, but Ive still watched planes go down for no apparent reason at crowded events.

I can only go by my own experience and say that the DSM2 or DSMX links have never caused me any problem at all, not the many guys I know who fly Spektrum. Sure models go down, they did long before Spektrum was ever heard of. DSM2 did have issues in 'noisy' environments (over 40 Tx's working), that's no secret but it's sorted out with DSMX and there is absolutely no objective evidence of any weakness in DSMX. The independent testing says it's solid: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fQKoXpj-FeI

 

[Manta]

Experience says it aint.
There are many who will say theyve not had a problem and many who will say they have. Either way, thats not good. And horizon or spectrum, whatever denied the problems and this is wrong.
Hitec had a problem early on and addresed it with a bulletin admitting there was a glitch somewhere and fixed it. I remember at Seff a cple years ago horizon did onsight upgrades for the dsmx deal. Planes were dropping out of the air after the upgrades. Lol. Saw it with my own eyes. Oops. Yep, they argued with me over and over how I was wrong. They wouldnt have changed the link if it was ok lol. i use dx6i only for bnf models i have to have it for, other than that, I got no love for the speckles radios. In the end, it dont matter what we think. Fly what ya want, fly often.

 

[gyro]

I fly my Spektrum often!
I trust the AR8000 on high speed mode in my 89" Slick, and that plane ain't cheap!
I also have had a past crash as result of a Spektrum receiver loosing link.... But it was because I browned it out by not using a good enough BEC at the time. I think this is where a majority of the Spektrum crashes are reported from.
Look at the market that Spektrum goes after with their radios and "bind and fly" combos? Newbs... And I was one once upon a time, and I was ignorant that time to think the problem was my RX, when in reality it was my inadequate setup.

 

[Manta]

Inadequate setups were their excuses too. Nope. Dont buy it. The planes i lost the power systems went into new planes and new guidance being the only difference and still rockin today.

 

[Steve_B]

i know it's 'radio wars' but even so, I do try to stay objective and (reasonably) balanced on these debates. IMHO personal opinion presented as fact doesn't add much to the discussion (e.g. 'brand x has a crap link').
No system is perfect in every respect. Spektrum have had issues in the past and the problems of DSM2 at the really large meetings like SEFF are well documented, acknowledged by Horizon, and addressed in the DSMX update. No argument from me on those points.

'Brown out' is something that's often labelled a Spektrum problem but fundamentally is in reality a problem caused by the BEC or battery failing to maintain adequate voltage supply to the receiver. It's far from a 'Spektrum only' issue as any receiver will fall over if it's voltage drops low enough. Brown out is more an issue associated with the inadequate linear BEC fitted to cheaper ESCs than anything else.
HOWEVER, I'll not argue that it is true that older Spektrum Rx's were more prone to brown out failure than some others. This is because Spektrum receivers at the time had a brown out voltage (i.e. a voltage that caused the Rx to shut down) that was higher than some other brands. Also older Spektrum Rx's took a little longer to re-boot after a brown out than some others. However these issues have been addressed on the latest receivers and they are now as 'brown out proof' as any on the market.

FWIW apparently Hitec receivers are almost as bad as older Spektrum in terms of the voltage they brown out at and time taken to re-connect. In fact Hitec can be worse because in 'scan mode' they wont reconnect after a brown out at all. What saves Hitec is their SPC feature that provides a separate power supply to the Rx which should ensure that the voltage never falls below spec. That of course only works if you actually use the SPC.

Anyway, the solution to brown-out for any system is to ensure the power supply to the Rx is adequate... do that and you haven't got a problem regardless of what brand you fly.

An impartial review: http://www.rcmodelreviews.com/2.4ghzshootout.shtml

 

[wedoitall]

'Brown out' is something that's often labelled a Spektrum problem but fundamentally a problem caused by the BEC or battery failing to maintain adequate voltage supply to the receiver. It's far from a 'Spektrum only' issue as any receiver will fall over if it's voltage drops low enough. Brown out is more an issue associated with the inadequate linear BEC fitted to cheaper ESCs than anything else.
HOWEVER, I'll not argue that it is true that older Spektrum Rx's were more prone to brown out failure than some others. This is because Spektrum receivers at the time had a brown out voltage (i.e. a voltage that caused the Rx to shut down) that was higher than some other brands. Also older Spektrum Rx's took a little longer to re-boot after a brown out than some others. However these issues have been addressed on the latest receivers and they are now as 'brown out proof' as any on the market.


Anyway, the solution to brown-out for any system is to ensure the power supply to the Rx is adequate... do that and you haven't got a problem regardless of what brand you fly.

An impartial review: http://www.rcmodelreviews.com/2.4ghzshootout.shtml

im a noob and compared to your guys time in the hobby and experience i will prolly always think of myself as a noob BUT i do my homework. im in the market for a new radio. i have read several reviews, articles, tech bullentins. etc. i have read several, several things about the brownout issues being blamed on spektrum as losted links. especially when 2.4 was in the early and rollout stages. people were crashing and losing their planes and since 2.4 was the only thing that had changed on their setup, they were blame'n spektrum and 2.4. and at first glance nobody really disagreed. but later on when on the bench for extensive tests. it was obvious that brownout were caused by inadequate BEC's and that power isssues were at fault in the majority of cases.
when anything new, especially with new technology where electronics and software are involved, theres gonna be issues in the first stages. just look at microsoft, apple, car manufactures, etc. and they are much bigger and have many more resources than our beloved hobby companies.

 

[Space Bat]

The orange rx's are as good as if not better than genuine Spektrum rx's....

I have no issue or problems with them...I no longer fly Spektrum but my mates and my son does...and my son uses orange rx's and even has one in his EF extra...thats how confident we are in them....

I don't 100% trust spektrum as seen some strange things go on ....and that has tended to be with the tx's and or with genuine rx's so whilst I have gone away from spektrum it is not to say that I have an overall problem with spektrum...or an anti spektrum belief and it was such a close call in getting a dx8 - but having flown FHSS and never had an issue it was only natural to go to futaba's new S-FHSS

Never did find my corsair that was on Spektrum - just flew off and had no control whatsoever....just flew and flew until I lost sight of it....bizarre