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Pilot RC 107" Extra 330SC

stangflyer

I like 'em "BIG"!
Hi guys!

Although I am new to this forum I have been following this build for quite a while. I must give a big thank you for the details you share. Especially to Joe hunt for the vids about programming. So helpful! however I am still struggling to figure everything out.
Anyway, I am about to finish a Pilot Extra 107". I will post some pics tomorrow to show what I have done so far.
Quick details : engine DLE111 with MTW mufflers. I have 2 savox 1268 per wing, 2 savox 1268 on the elevator, 1 savox 2230 on the rudder and one MKS on throttle. I also use a Smartfly EQ10 with a 14 channels Futaba receiver, 2 Pulse batteries ( 3600mah) and a Ultra Ibec.
When you will see the pictures, could you tell me if I need to modify something? My biggest concern is about the rudder system : you will see a giant arm which helps keeping the wires ( pull-pull system) from loosening. I am not quite sure one servo will be enough...
One question : The EQ10 is so easy to use! I love it. So, I programmed all my servos. I wanted to check if my elevator was working properly. I have programmed my end points and center, on high rates, accurately. However, when I switch to low rate ( I do it with a condition setting on my Futaba programmer), I notice that there is a small difference between the two sides of the elevator. I also notice that one servo goes slightly faster than the other one. I tried to fix the problem while changing the length of the pushrod, but it does nothing spectacular.. I guess the problem comes from that the two 1268 servos are not exactly the same and I should change the speed of one. I have a "speed" menu in my transmiter, maybe it is the way to go?
I don't think I will notice something when the Extra will be in the air, but I would like to understand if I could improve my settings. Could you help me with that?

thanks a lot
Ok...so this is actually an easy fix. The problem is not your servos, the speeds or anything related. That is unless you are using two different type servos for Ailerons, two different for elevators, etc. As long as you use the "same" servo for each control surface, (i.e., 1268's on "BOTH" elevator halves, etc.) your end result will be matching movement on the surfaces. The problem you are having is that you are "MIXING" a program to (2) servos with a "condition" on your transmitter. Hence, you are getting two separate values for the two separate servos. I also use "Smart-Fly" power expanders. In my opinion, they are so darned easy to use and offer such a great deal of insurance with redundancy. What I do to set these up is to use two separate channels for my Ailerons, Two separate channels for my elevators, two separate channels for the rudder as well, and then set the values for each control surface. The two separate rudder will not apply in this case as you are using (1) rudder servo so you will only use one rudder channel. Therefore when you set your dual rates, the amount of throw for all surfaces remain what your initial value is for your high rates, your low rates are reduced and determined by what you set for your dual rate and expo values. Make sense? I use this setup on all my 100cc to my largest ships. By running separate channels for each control surface, you get the best accuracy of tuning...Plus you are also adding in a redundancy for safety. In the event...(Hypothetical situation) You lose your left aileron for some really odd reason.... you are not depending on that channel to control your right aileron. Case in point that "ACTUALLY" did in fact happen to me last weekend with my 129" 40% Yak. Situation. My son helped me set the Yak up for flying that day when we arrived to the field. He and I use the same setups basically and even the same hardware from different vendors like @Taildragger RC. So, he plugged my wings in...(Using the Multiplex harness), then plugs my stabs in. I bolt everything down, fuel up and fly two really good flights. He leaves for home and I put one more flight on the Yak. Upon doing an aileron roll, I noticed the Yak just "DID NOT" roll at the normal rate. I immediately landed and discovered that my left aileron driven by three servos on that wing had absolutely no functional operation. I brought the plane around for a very uneventful set up and touch down. Every thing "seemed" fine. Now why the harness came disconnected is a mystery, as my son is "VERY" astute and rarely makes a mistake. Either way, I flew the plane to safety and touch down on one aileron. Now I also understand that had I been using just one channel for the ailerons, the end result would still have been the same with an unplugged harness. But the point is, by running separate channels for each half of your control surface, you can fine tune to "Equal" values each control surface and also have redundancy safety in the event you loose a flight control channel in flight. A side note to keep in mind, I am doing this with a simple 9 channel receiver and only utilizing 7 of those 9 channels. It is a "very" easy setup with the least amount of stress in setting up. I hope this helps and didn't confuse you too much.
 
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yakken

100cc
Hi guys!

Although I am new to this forum I have been following this build for quite a while. I must give a big thank you for the details you share. Especially to Joe hunt for the vids about programming. So helpful! however I am still struggling to figure everything out.
Anyway, I am about to finish a Pilot Extra 107". I will post some pics tomorrow to show what I have done so far.
Quick details : engine DLE111 with MTW mufflers. I have 2 savox 1268 per wing, 2 savox 1268 on the elevator, 1 savox 2230 on the rudder and one MKS on throttle. I also use a Smartfly EQ10 with a 14 channels Futaba receiver, 2 Pulse batteries ( 3600mah) and a Ultra Ibec.
When you will see the pictures, could you tell me if I need to modify something? My biggest concern is about the rudder system : you will see a giant arm which helps keeping the wires ( pull-pull system) from loosening. I am not quite sure one servo will be enough...
One question : The EQ10 is so easy to use! I love it. So, I programmed all my servos. I wanted to check if my elevator was working properly. I have programmed my end points and center, on high rates, accurately. However, when I switch to low rate ( I do it with a condition setting on my Futaba programmer), I notice that there is a small difference between the two sides of the elevator. I also notice that one servo goes slightly faster than the other one. I tried to fix the problem while changing the length of the pushrod, but it does nothing spectacular.. I guess the problem comes from that the two 1268 servos are not exactly the same and I should change the speed of one. I have a "speed" menu in my transmiter, maybe it is the way to go?
I don't think I will notice something when the Extra will be in the air, but I would like to understand if I could improve my settings. Could you help me with that?

thanks a lot
sounds like your expo is not the same when switching conditions for each servo.

Sent from my SM-G930P using Tapatalk
 

Beaublus

New to GSN!
Hello again

My TX is a Futaba R6014HS. I don't think the problem comes from an "expo" issue, because I checked it twice and it was correct.
Thanks Stangflyer for your advice. As I have plenty of channels on the expander I have decided to follow your lead. I am going to use on servo on each channel.
I think I will able to fix my problem with your method as I will be able to set every servo on each half elevator. Indeed with the Futaba "elevator" setting, you set expos and rates for both servos. With one servo per channel, I will adjust expos and dual rates on each servo. I am going to try that. I will tell you if it works or not.
I will also do the same on each aileron.

I add some pics below. You will see how I have installed my engine. I had to make a long arm on the carb to use all the servo course.
On the rudder I use a big 2230. Do you think it is enough power with such a long rudder arm?
 

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stangflyer

I like 'em "BIG"!
Hello again

My TX is a Futaba R6014HS. I don't think the problem comes from an "expo" issue, because I checked it twice and it was correct.
Thanks Stangflyer for your advice. As I have plenty of channels on the expander I have decided to follow your lead. I am going to use on servo on each channel.
I think I will able to fix my problem with your method as I will be able to set every servo on each half elevator. Indeed with the Futaba "elevator" setting, you set expos and rates for both servos. With one servo per channel, I will adjust expos and dual rates on each servo. I am going to try that. I will tell you if it works or not.
I will also do the same on each aileron.

I add some pics below. You will see how I have installed my engine. I had to make a long arm on the carb to use all the servo course.
On the rudder I use a big 2230. Do you think it is enough power with such a long rudder arm?
I think you will discover that you will really like setting up individual servo (flight control) channels. It just makes refining your throws so easy and right on a "knats ass" accurate. Doesn't matter if you're running JR, Futaba, Spektrum, Hitec or any other radio brand. As for your rudder setup, at 580 oz. torque @ 7.4, you will probably be good. Maybe not for some really insane 3d, but light 3D it'll probably be ok. I usually run two rudder servos for the extra "ooomph" for the really demanding 3D maneuvers. But this would be a good question for the guys that run Savox servos and guys that have run one rudder servo. As for your rudder arm, usually a 4" arm is a good choice. But again, I usually run two rudder servos on 100cc planes. So I usually set my rudders up push/pull.
 

Joe Hunt

150cc
Man you do nice work, Beaublus! :way_to_go:

Your throttle resolution should be awesome with that long arm on the carb! Awesome!

I'm not thrilled with your wiring on the TechAero IBEC, though. There is a "dirty" side and a "clean" side. And, you have the clean side running back over the dirty side with the dirty and clean wires together.

Let us know if you get the elevators sorted out with the suggestions you've received! We've all run into that problem and then fixed it, so I'm sure that will work out. :)
 

Beaublus

New to GSN!
Thanks Joe!! I installed the throttle servo inside the fuse and I had to put a long arm on my throttle servo. That's why I was losing more than half of my resolution. I needed to keep an accurate servo resolution and the long arm was the answer. Besides I had to avoid the pipes! Next time, I will probably install the throttle servo outside the engine box which would be easier.
What do you mean by "clean" and "dirty" side? Which side is clean? The one on the ignition or on the Ibec? I will do my best to make it "cleaner";)
I was going to get my elevators sorted out today ( and also the ailerons, with Stangflyers' method), but I broke my shoulder while falling off my mountaing bike! :face-palm::face-palm: I 'll try ( actually hope) to do it tomorrow!

Joe, what do you think about my rudder system? I carried out many tests and the length ( and offset) of my rudder arm was the one to keep tight wires! I completely agree with Stangflyers : one servo will be enough to play around but probably not for extreme 3D. ( which I don't do) However it would be stupid to crash 3000$ airplane because I didn't spend an extra 100$ for a servo!
 

Joe Hunt

150cc
And, do you have some type of vibration absorption (foam or velcro) under the IBEC and also under the ignition? Under the ignition I like to leave an air gap for cooling, as well.
 

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Joe Hunt

150cc
Joe, what do you think about my rudder system? I carried out many tests and the length ( and offset) of my rudder arm was the one to keep tight wires! I completely agree with Stangflyers : one servo will be enough to play around but probably not for extreme 3D. ( which I don't do) However it would be stupid to crash 3000$ airplane because I didn't spend an extra 100$ for a servo!

Yeah, most guys don't take the time to make sure their non-pulling cable is not getting loose (and worse is tight). If the control horn pivot point on the rudder is offset from the hinge line of the rudder than you need to use that same offset amount on the rudder arm (if the cables are parallel). On 1/3 scales with pull/pull I need two servos, but with push/pull one feels great (although I think two will last longer).
 
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